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  • Rolling your R's

    In the last year I have discovered that I have an affinity for everything Scottish...which started with my favorite Scottish singer..Alex Beaton. My ancestry goes back to Anglo-Saxon people (Tibbits plus others). I'm hoping I have some Scot in me. I am a musician and learning Scot songs, but my gaelic is poor and I'm trying to learn how to speak like a Scot. I've checked the board and will follow some of the suggestions. I listen to Alex's music constantly to hear the language. What I'm having the hardest time with is rolling my r's. I don't get it! I would appreciate advice as to how to do it...like, where does the tongue go..etc. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance
    Arizona Don
    http://www.dastcom.com

  • #2
    Twelve people viewed your thread ahead of me, and twelve people did not have the heart to tell you this:

    Please don't even try it. You will only end up looking a prat (a bit like Alex Beaton himself).

    Comment


    • #3
      Whoops.
      I must be naive about this discussion board. The Scot dialect I hear, and love to hear, is a variation of English..but with the beautiful Scottish ring. This must be different than Gaelic (which I'm sure also is melodic) that this board is about. Sorry.
      By the way, this colonist doesn't know what a prat is..but, it doesn't sound like something I want to be. I've met Alex a number of times and if he's a prat, he's a very nice prat...and he has a wonderful voice and is a master on the guitar...does great work on songs like 'Bonnie Dundee' (which I have also recorded) and many others.
      Any suggestions/web sites about the Scot language I'm interested in would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for letting me know I'm barking up the wrong board...and warning me that my lack of knowledge about this subject would lead to me being looked on as being a prat. Thaht suends bloody bahd...achhh!

      Comment


      • #4
        As you can see, we have an entire forum dedicated to the Scots language(s)here at Scotland.com. Have you read any of it?
        My earlier comments to you were not meant to discourage you from increasing your knowledge about our language, but merely to dissuade you from a dubious attempt a mimicry (how do you "roll an r"?).

        Comment


        • #5
          Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, but a fake Scots accent (e.g. Scotty from Star Trek, or Richard Attenborough's character in Jurassic Park) can really make one cringe.

          I don't think anyone has a problem with you wanting to get an authentic sound, Arizona, it's just that getting it wrong can come across as parody. If you're serious, find a voice coach. Otherwise, I'd advise you to sing in your own voice.

          Comment


          • #6
            Whahaha! Fun thread this is...
            Wow... 'rolling an R'... Maybe this will help. First let me tell you I am dutch and we dutchies seem to be know as language experts... (could start an other discussion about that!)

            A few years ago I travelled through South Africa with Scottish and English people. We also had one dutch guy in our group called Jeroen... He introduced himself as Jerome because his orig. name should be to difficult to pronounce. Aha! We didn't want to let the group get away with that one so we decided it should be our mission to let the group pronounce his name correctly... Mission failed though... the R in his name you know.... Well, what we did found out was that the pron. of the R in english is soft and dull (in our ears then). To let an R roll, you really have to losen up your tounge and place the tip of your tounge in the front of your mouth, behind the tooth... Also; flatten your tongue!
            Practice with 'row'... Don't let any air slip through and let it just do all the work...

            Good luck and keep listening to those great Scottish singers! ;-)

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            • #7
              cool
              where in holland
              i would love 2 learn dutch
              can u let me know more info
              willie

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              • #8
                Hiya Dan, I,m a total newbie to this forum and 100% Scots. I,ve been pondering for ten minutes...... exactly how does one instruct another to roll his/her R,s?????? Lin,s reply is probably spot on...

                But - I remember my brothers when they were wee - rolling their Matchbox cars across the floor, saying "vvrrrrooom.... vrrrroooom".... ultimate example of rolling cars and R,s at the same time..... Now if this makes any sense, it,s the nearest solution I can come up with. <grin>

                Good luck bonnie laddie.

                Christine

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                • #9
                  Dancer and Lin..thank you for your suggestions. I really appreciate a little direction. Of course, I could watch 'Braveheart' over and over again and try to mimic the actors speech. Whether or not the verbiage was said in proper Scot I do not know, but it sounded right to an American boy who grew up in upstate New York...and has just found out that my great-grandmother was a Scott (Georgia Scott). I just love the Scots and their interpretation of the English language.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by ArizonaDon
                    . . Of course, I could watch 'Braveheart' over and over again and try to mimic the actors speech. Whether or not the verbiage was said in proper Scot I do not know, but it sounded right to an American boy who grew up in upstate New York
                    I'm afraid it wasnt. It would have helped if they had actually cast Scots in the main role(s).

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                    • #11
                      That is one big strike against the English, they killed the native tongue

                      How many young people still speak a native form of Scottish Gaellic or is it moribund as we speak? It is sad when people lose their traditions. North Americans will always put some "imitation" accent, rather than be accurate and thorough and get it right with a true member of that society.

                      By the way, I know absolutely nothing about Scottish music. I couldn't name you a single recording artist, past or present of Scottish origin. It goes to show you how sometimes we are all encapsulated in our own societies. If it sounds anything as pretty as Irish music, I would love to hear it.
                      “I have learned that you can win the battle over the most powerful of nations, the United States, if you have the moral force behind you.” — Rubén Berríos (about his transforming experience after the sacrifices he had to make for the Navy-Vieques protests)

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                      • #12
                        Hello The_Bruce person, what's your opinion on this European Union all one Currency

                        Bruce, what's your feeling about all this European Union, one currency, let's all be one people idea? Is it good, is it bad? I do not have an opinion I am not European. What's yours? Curious, PRgirl.
                        “I have learned that you can win the battle over the most powerful of nations, the United States, if you have the moral force behind you.” — Rubén Berríos (about his transforming experience after the sacrifices he had to make for the Navy-Vieques protests)

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                        • #13
                          how to roll an r

                          It's not that easy, until you can do it.

                          Some people claim they cannot do it, along
                          the lines of rolling up their tounge to
                          make a pipe-like shape. This is wrong,
                          and anyone normal can roll their r.

                          It's a dynamic vibration of the tip of the
                          tongue against the ridge behind the upper
                          teeth, caused by air flow over a loose
                          and correctly positioned tongue.

                          Don't try and move your tongue tip. The air
                          flow does it for you. To start with, use
                          plenty of air.

                          Most people can make a trill with their lips already
                          (brrr it's cold...? or a horse noise?)
                          and most people can make a raspberry with
                          the tongue sticking out (it's usually the lower
                          lip that vibrates, but you can do upper, or both)
                          and if you can, do these, and feel how you use
                          air and the position of the lax lips to
                          create the trilling.

                          Now you need to try to create the same feeling
                          in the tip of the tongue.

                          Once you've trilled your tongue tip, time to learn
                          to trill your uvula!

                          Jim

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Jim,
                            thank you for the detailed instructions. I appreciate the time you took to describe the process.
                            Thanks to you other fine Scots for helping me with the 'rolling r'.

                            PRGirl. To hear some great Scottish music Alex Beatons web site is http://www.alexbeaton.com. It's a shame that he has to come here to make a living singing he beautiful songs of the Scots and the Irish. I've been to many of his concerts here in Arizona. By the way, Alex is not a PRAT. He was born and raised in Scotland and tells of Scot history in his concert. I have recorded a few Scot songs (Bonnie Dundee, Seven Drunken Nights, and soon These Are My Mountains), But I don't have his voice, and you purists will cringe at very poor Scot accent . Besides the cds, I have them available (free) on my music website http://www.dontibbits.com/music.html . Mine are totally created in my home, where Alex is a pro and does his recording in a studio. If your interested, I can give you the names of the cds of his that I think are the best.

                            I realize that i am naive about the Scottish language and am sorry that my quest is sad for those among you who believe that the Scottish language that you grew up with is being basterdized. But the Scottish I hear may be wrong, but it is beautiful to my ears.

                            I have just discovered that my wife is a direct descendant of many Scottish Kings and Queens (and English Kings and Queens). I'm still trying to make a connection with my great-grandmother Georgia Scott.

                            Thanks to all of you for all the emails
                            Don Tibbits
                            dast@dastcom.com

                            Library of Photography http://www.libraryofphotography.com/
                            Library of Links http://www.libraryoflinks.com/
                            Library of Arizona http://www.libraryofarizona.com/
                            Library of Macintosh http://www.dastcom.com/lom/lom.html

                            Don Tibbits Photography http://www.dontibbits.com/
                            Don Tibbits Music http://www.dontibbits.com/music.html

                            Dastcom Graphics http://www.dastcom.com/
                            Dastcom Mall http://www.dastcommall.com/
                            ----------------------------------------------------------------

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                            • #15
                              Re: That is one big strike against the English, they killed the native tongue

                              Originally posted by PRgirl
                              How many young people still speak a native form of Scottish Gaellic or is it moribund as we speak? It is sad when people lose their traditions. North Americans will always put some "imitation" accent, rather than be accurate and thorough and get it right with a true member of that society.
                              For 2000-01, there were 34 Gaidhlig medium nurseries with 413 kids; 1862 pupils in Gaidhlig medium primary schools; 909 pupils in fluent Gaidhlig classes in High Schools and 2310 kids in Gaidhlig Learners classes in high schools. This is quite a change from 2 units and 30 pupils in 1985. I would say the language is far from dead and the numbers of Gaidhlig learners is really encouraging. We are waiting on preliminary data from this year's census to see the results of those questions.
                              Open up The Original Pipe Box!
                              www.piperdave.co.uk

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