Casting Pearls

[ANDY-J]

Theja,
I do not question the morality of Christ's teachings.I regard Christ as an enlightened spiritual teacher and anyone who adheres to his credo of unconditional love and tolerance for others will certainly grow spiritually and attain "salvation" which I believe is the same enlightened state of consciousness that Bhuddists term nirvana.I do not dispute that many aspects of christianity are good.It provides hope and comfort for people in need and communal worship can be spiritually uplifting.However I believe that many of the doctrines promoted by the Christian church are fundamentally flawed and were never part of Christ's teachings.I cannot accept that anyone can be condemned to eternal suffering for the mistakes which they make in one lifetime and I do not accept that a loving God would ever judge us.Self imposed suffering in the sense of seperateness from God through an unwillingness to accept his love and our spiritual oneness with him I can understand but given that I believe our spirits will exist for eternity there is always hope that by our own strivings we can attain enlightenment and a true knowledge of God.Human beings are inherently imperfect so it seems a very harsh doctrine which would punish us eternally because we chose not to follow christianity in one lifetime.I believe that each human being is involved in the same journey back to God and we each have the free will to choose the path which we believe will take us there.The means of attaining a true knowledge of God are to practice love and tolerance for others and to reject the path of materialism.All of the major world faiths teach this and all have as the golden rule the doctrine of "do unto others as you would have them do unto you".

[J-J]

Theja - sorry I didn't mean any offence by the word charlatan.Maybe it's too strong a word-the idea that Jesus didn't believe in his own divinity is just a hunch I entertain sometimes.I do think it is true of some of the prophets though,epecially Muhammed who IMO knew exactly what he was doing.
Basically though,I do think Jesus was a force for good.His pacifism and humanity were signs of an enlightened mind as Andy says.I don't believe he was the son of God,that's all.We'll just have to differ on that.

[Theja]

Hi JJ, Christianity is a matter of faith. If you don't belive in the divinity of Christ, that is your opinion, and you're entitled to that. Because God is not a cosmic mind rapist forcing everyone to believe what He revealed in scripture. As for me, the divinity of Jesus was proven beyond doubt by His death and resurrection. And the eyewitnesses, his disciples gave their lives preaching it. Even psychologists say that no one would die for a lie. The disciples died willingly rather than renounce the death and resurrection of Christ.

I agree with you on Muhammad. He would commit a crime or sexual immorality and justify them with pronouncements from Allah; and his followers would guess it was alright for Allah to grant his apostle 'special privilege'. The prophet could do no wrong attitude.


Theja

[Mamie]

I see you've been getting some responses.

Like Andy I believe that Jesus is a good teacher and if all so called Christians followed his teachings the world would be a better place.

My main objection is the view of people like you who think that their path to God is the only possible one. That those of us who follow a different path are somehow inferior or damned unless we choose to believe as you do. I do not believe in heaven or hell. The devil is fiction.

My primary guide in life is a form of a golden rule that I may do as I please provided I do not cause harm to someone else. I don't always achieve it but..I try.

Islam as practiced by flawed human beings may not be the religion of choice but it isn't all bad. The same is true for Christianity. Look at all the divisions within the general term. Your words seem to imply that Catholicism is bad but it is no more flawed than many other sects that profess to believe in Jesus as the Son of God or God.

It is how you live your life that would impress me not your words. I don't know you or your works so I make no judgements about how you do things to help those around you. You may be a great person. But remember the old cliche that you get more flies with sugar than vinegar is true. An example makes for better instruction than a lecture 9 times out of ten.

[Theja]

Mamie, about Jesus being a good teacher or moral force, I quote C.S. Lewis:

"I am trying here to prevent anyone saying the really foolish thing that people say about Him: 'I am ready to accept Jesus as a good moral teacher, but I don't accept His claim to be God'. That is the one thing we must not say. A man who was merely a man and said the sort of things Jesus said would not be a great moral teacher. He would either be a lunatic -- on a level with the man who says he is a poached egg -- or else He would be the Devil of Hell. You must make your choice. Either this man was, and is, the Son of God; or else a madman or something worse".

" You can shut Him up for a fool, you can spit at Him and kill Him as a demon; or you can fall at His feet and call Him Lord and God. But let us not come up with any patronising nonsense about His being a great human teacher. He has not left that open to us. He did not intend to."

Mamie, Christans are not perfect, but you, Andy and the world are having a better life already because of them. Only you don't see it that way. Your opinion is not always right.

There are realities outside of you whether you realize (or believe) it or not. You may say there is no Brazil, but the fact remain. In your opinion there is no heaven, hell, or devil. If Jesus is true, you may end up in one and realize the others one day. I would take Jesus' words over yours. You don't know everything; I would rely on the knowledge of the Bible rather than yours.

You have the right to exercise your rational mind and make observaton about different religions. But not all can lead to God. If there is a God, there must be only one way, one truth, one salvation. For God is not the author of confusion. The Devil is.

Since you are spiritually blind, describing Christian spirituality is like describing color television to a blind person. For you to talk about different Christian denomination is like a stranger attempting to describe your hometown to you without visiting your place.

You don't believe in demons. I do. I have cast out demons in Jesus' name. Hey Mamie, you may be skeptical here, but you have the opinion and I have the experience here. Some drug addicts are oppressed by demons, but they don't realize it. That is why some addicts don't recover inspite of all kinds of treatments and counselling.

Well, now you have a lot to write back. And then I'll reply.

[Mamie]

You will not convince me I'm wrong and I will not convince you that there are other ways.

You've assumed that I do not have experience in "Christianity". Wrong I left it.

[AutumnReel]

Originally posted by ANDY-J
Theja,
Do you think the christian fundamentalist argument of divine judgement and eternal damnation is morally acceptable?I believe in reincarnation and that the purpose of life is to grow and develop spiritually.I see little merit in a religion which promises eternal punishment for an individual simply on the strength of their beliefs.

Who is to say what is and what isn't morally acceptable in the eyes of God? God is a loving God, and I speak from my relationship with him, but who are any of us to judge God? I think that where we differ is that I believe that human's have a sinful nature and are not deserving of grace. It seems that you limit God to our knowledge and understanding.