Sartre, Camus and All Things Non-Religious

[Alexis_US]

I don't pretend to be a scholar, but I am interested in these themes. Anyone else. I am not sure of the etiquette of this, but can I kindly ask for all who traverse here to refrain from Bible quotes? The idea is not to start a Christ versus us heathens debate, but to start a discussion for people interested in discussing modern thought on non-belief.

[Liv]

Well Alexis, what a great idea you got there, and your right ,us "heathens" are defenetly not looking to pick a fight with anyone, but in my experiance, now one i've meat on this board is.
But what do you believe in, in my opinion everyone must believe in something, but it is not neccesarily a God, i know many people who have their very own "religion", not that their narrow-minded, not at all, they just can't fit into any religions, and then , here we are, said to be bewildered , and without any answers.!!!not true.!!
I would like to discuss philosophy with you, it has my interest, and as you said, i'm not the greatest thinker there ever lived, but really, does it matter?We can discuss matters just as much as anyone, you haven't got to have a degree to do that.
I hope to discuss a?? matter further with you, i could be interesting.

regards Maria.

[Alexis_US]

Hi Maria!
I am not sure I can articulate what I believe in and unfortunately I don't have books to quote from to make my points for me.
I also know folks who have created their own religions for various reasons. But I know that that would not be an option for me since I find the concept of religion anathema. I think that very often people replace one set of dogmatic beliefs with another. And many people go to church, synagogue, mosque, temple etc... out of habit and to feel a sense of community. I find it sad that some choose to perpetuate a system that brings them no joy or comfort and that they cannot feel kinship to people who practice other religions.
The truly sad thing in my opinion is that there seems to be a lot of "going through the motions" throughout society. Like we are a world depressed and we consume by rote all that is fed to us, be it music, fashion, politics, religion or art. I guess I can only speak for the US, but I fear that the lifeless corporate culture of the US is slowly encroaching the rest of the world. I always like to use the example of Madonna as someone who typifies the American consumer culture. She uses the name of the mother of Jesus, then she sings in sanskrit some holy hindu text. Trendy spirituality that can be had by buying a trippy t-shirt sporting a renditon of Ganesh, or Vishnu or Shiva. It is cool to be spiritual, it is passe to be political and it will all change any minute with no prior notice.
All written without coffee!
ps maria, for fight picking evidence, please see "Atheists...." thread.
Alexis
"God is a concept by which we measure our pain." ---John Lennon

Originally posted by Alexis_US:
I don't pretend to be a scholar, but I am interested in these themes. Anyone else. I am not sure of the etiquette of this, but can I kindly ask for all who traverse here to refrain from Bible quotes? The idea is not to start a Christ versus us heathens debate, but to start a discussion for people interested in discussing modern thought on non-belief.

I too am interested in Sartre, Camus, etc... I took a couple of philosophy courses in college, eons ago. My philosophy prof. was brilliant. I don't really know as much as I'd like, so I can't contribute to the discussion with lots of scholarly references, footnotes, and dazzling graphics.

There's enough room on this Scotland.com discussion board for some dedicated, serious discussions. I think everyone can be accomodated. All we need is a little respect.

I'll be back later, after I get some sleep.

First of all, I can't quote from the scriptures, and I'm not an atheist either.
So, my question to non-believers of anything is, do you believe in spirituality of any kind?

------------------
Gaol, Dilseachd, Cairdeas

[Alexis_US]

Hi, all!
Becca: your inability to quote from the scriptures is an asset here!
I can only speak for myself: I have explored a lot of systems of belief in my short life and I have found them all lacking. Which probably just means that I lack faith in them. I believe that adhering to another person's system of belief and thought is controlling. You give away your power when you play by the rules of organized religion. I am sure the same thing can be said of government, family, etc... and I am not a true anarchist, but I do feel that we are given a choice as to whether to believe in religion or not. I hope I do not alienate too many people when I quote Marx, who said that religion was the "opiate of the masses," meaning that if you stay high on God you don't get pissed off at the unfair way you are treated in society. I think that is as true today as when he wrote of it in London in the 1840's. I do realize that someone started a similar thread on this topic at some point and that person was shut down.
(Sonsie, look at how defensive that atheists thread got me!) I am only trying to give a little background on why some of us to not believe.
I would not say that I totally deny the existence of a power greater than myself, but I am a-theist, meaning theology, meaning a set of doctrines that form a religion. I believe a great deal of what Carl Jung wrote has validity, about the human soul. But his explanations of the soul make sense of things that are tangible, like dreams and archetypal images. So I guess I believe in a collective unconscious, which does not necessarily include a God to moderate.
Phew. All I can handle for the moment.
Cheers,
Alexis

[cloud]

Voltaire ( at least I think it was Voltaire), said something along the lines of;
"If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him in order to keep peace and order in our society."
Every culture in history seems to have had a belief in something metaphysical.
So I'm wondering, if man had no fear of a "judgement day", and eternal retribution, would we be civilized at all? If left to our own ends to work out the rules, would the laws we live by now be similar, or would we have a completely different outlook on everything?