Broken Britain1 (Moved from other forum)

[Scotsgait]

Originally Posted by DreadGod

Thats because the vast majority of the population is Scotland is white. I should mention that the majority of the population in London is white too (only just), but the knife crime is disproportionatly more black criminals.

So, what is the cause of the broken society in Scotland ? What was the cause of the broken society in London in the days of the Krays ? You can't blame immigration there.

[JCfromGA]

DG and Andy,

We have a similar problem here in the US among immigrants and natives... Here in the US, some programs even provide housing. The more kids you have, the larger the housing accommodations. It doesn't matter if you're an immigrant... or even have legal status since your children are native by birth... so you just have to have them here... and the US government (taxpayers will support them).

As for skilled labor, it is sad that it is restricted due to the large immigration of low skill workers which increase the unemployment rate. The UK just like the US benefits from attracting skilled labor such as people in the medical field. The unemployment rate keeps people who would be a benefit to the country from seeking legal work visas due to the expense and the red tape.

Take me for example, if I immigrated there. I am highly skilled therefore I don't have to go through the red tape... but I come over. I provide specialized medical care to the citizens of your country. I pay a lot of taxes (cause I'm single). Then I go home after a year or two of experiencing your beautiful country. Seems like a win win situation. Unfortunately, only very high demand people can do that... so many people who would be willing to come over for a while and work just to experience the country and its culture... don't because of the hassle. I do see how that is a direct result of large low skill immigration.

[DreadGod]

Originally Posted by Scotsgait

So, what is the cause of the broken society in Scotland ? What was the cause of the broken society in London in the days of the Krays ? You can't blame immigration there.

I'm not blaming immigration for crime in Scotland. Although crime in Scotland is not nearly as bad as people make it out to be. Especially compared to England. Look at the population differences for a start. I am also not blamming immigration for crime in London which happened decades ago, such as the Krays. However I am blaming immigration for a disprortionate amount of crime in London over the last two decades.

[ANDY-J3]

I see now that DreadGod's argument may not be racist. It is fair to say that an increase in immigration into the inner cities has worsened the social problems which already existed and if immigrant families are compelled to live on benefits in sub standard council housing then it isn't surprising that they get sucked into a spiral of violence and crime to a greater extent than more affluent white people. The key factor causing the problems is extreme social deprivation not ethnic origins.

[DreadGod]

Originally Posted by ANDY-J3

I see now that DreadGod's argument may not be racist. It is fair to say that an increase in immigration into the inner cities has worsened the social problems which already existed and if immigrant families are compelled to live on benefits in sub standard council housing then it isn't surprising that they get sucked into a spiral of violence and crime to a greater extent than more affluent white people. The key factor causing the problems is extreme social deprivation not ethnic origins.

Poverty is no excuse, there have always been poor people yet crime is increasing, maybe because the number of poorer people is increasin, answer; cut immigration. There are many poor people who get on with life without commiting any crime. However in London there is a disproportionate amount of crime amongst certain ethnic groups and poverty should not be used as an excuse.

[ANDY-J3]

Poverty isn't an excuse but if a particular group of people feel socially isolated and are lacking in employment prospects they don't have any incentive to conform to society's rules. Immigration is pointless if all it does is allow people to exchange a life of poverty in their own country for one in the UK. Immigration shouldn't be stopped completely but it should be more rigorously controlled. If you don't have a trade and a decent grasp of English then you shouldn't be allowed into the country. Labour aren't going to do anything about it so we'll see if the Tories will fulfill their promises and radically overhaul the current system.

[DreadGod]

Originally Posted by ANDY-J3

Poverty isn't an excuse but if a particular group of people feel socially isolated and are lacking in employment prospects they don't have any incentive to conform to society's rules. Immigration is pointless if all it does is allow people to exchange a life of poverty in their own country for one in the UK. Immigration shouldn't be stopped completely but it should be more rigorously controlled. If you don't have a trade and a decent grasp of English then you shouldn't be allowed into the country. Labour aren't going to do anything about it so we'll see if the Tories will fulfill their promises and radically overhaul the current system.

I do agree. Down here in London, on many occasions I've come across people in Customer Service Jobs, over the phone who can't speak proper English and its unbeleivable that they are being employed if they can't speak the launguage of the vast majority of the population. To be fair I even had college tutors who didn't speak very good English, which I was appalled at. It basically meant that they were not good teachers. The over the top immigration levels are definatley Labour's doing. I can't work out the reasons why they let it get so bad it just seems stupid. UKIP would definatley take action.