Scotland Forums Community


Go Back   Scotland Discussion Forum > Culture > Religion and Philosophy
User Name
Password
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 15th December 2006, 11:31
Gypsum_Fantastic's Avatar
Gypsum_Fantastic Gypsum_Fantastic is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 847
The English Bible has made us

The English Bible has made us
Rod Liddle

There is an interesting debate doing the rounds at the moment: should we allow faith schools in Britain? The debate has been occasioned by our tortuous and interminable wrangling with all things Islamic; it has suddenly occurred to us that allowing children to be inculcated into an ideology which may be antithetical to our national culture is a dangerous and divisive thing. And during the course of filming a two-hour documentary for Channel 4 about the translation of the Bible into English, I was struck by the strange, almost perverse nature of this debate. It seems to be polarised: you are either for faith schools or you are against them. It is almost a given that if you oppose Muslim faith schools, you must, with even-handedness, oppose Church of England faith schools. Needless to say, there is no similar debate in Saudi Arabia, Iran or Pakistan; there, of course, they feel no instinctive compulsion to level the religious playing field. Each of those nations, no matter how recently they may have been conjured up by the sweep of a foreign pen, is wholly aware that its national culture is drawn from Islam. The same is true, to a less rigorous degree, in the more devoutly Roman Catholic countries.

And so two apparently paradoxical thoughts occur; firstly, that Britain is a Christian country, that almost every area of public life is rooted in Christian teachings and that this history of ours cannot simply be swept away or disavowed, as some would seem to hope. And secondly, that this British even-handedness towards competing religions is quintessentially Christian and, crucially, English Protestant. By this I do not mean the screeching Protestantism of the likes of Ian Paisley, but Protestantism in its more literal meaning — a creed which sprang from the common people, which was forced to demand tolerance for its own adherents. And which, through its commitment to individual interpretation, has tended to be rather open to those who disagree with its constantly shifting tenets.

Just recently my colleague Charles Moore carried out a swift, ad-hoc audit of some of those things which might disappear were we to decide that Christianity had outlived its usefulness in Britain; looking around him in the central lobby at the House of Commons, he counted 17 direct references to Christ ‘in as many seconds’; to expunge Christianity from British life, he continued, one would also have to rename most of our capital’s railway stations, tear down our national flag (and the Royal Standard) and melt down our coinage, rename our Oxbridge colleges, change our public holidays.

And of course, he is right. But luckily, the defenestration of a Christian God simply cannot happen, because far more important than the flags and the coins of the realm and what have you, Protestant Christianity is the very essence of what it is to be British: it gave us our language, our national identity and, with both of these things, a template for how we think and reason. You cannot easily uproot all that.

The influence of Protestant Christianity upon our language and thus literature is impossible to overstate. When the Gloucestershire scholar William Tyndale went up to Magdalen Hall, Oxford, in 1510 the English language — in so far as one could ascribe to it a homogenous existence — was held in such contempt that it was banned from the college altogether, excepting feast days. As a result of Tyndale’s translation of the New Testament in 1534, it became a national language, complete and concise, with a sense of cadence and rhythm, of direct purpose, which has endured to this day. Without William Tyndale it is doubtful that there would have been a William Shakespeare — doubtful that there would have been an England.

In 1510 England was an authoritarian outpost of the Catholic Church — a country where, uniquely, it was illegal to read the Bible in the national language. Instead, commoners were dependent on the Church for their religious succour — which naturally invested the Church with enormous power. Hence, therefore, the Church’s disinclination to allow the Bible into the grubby paws of ploughmen and, indeed, ‘lowly women’. Control the language and you control the people. Tyndale, of course, rejected all that; the people must be able to read the Bible for themselves, otherwise they could not be saved. For Tyndale — as for Wycliffe before him — it was a purely theological opposition which nonetheless had immediate social and political repercussions. His translation of the Bible — the King James Bible is regarded as being 90 per cent the work of Tyndale — passed power downwards from the priests and bishops to the people, both by the mere fact of its existence and in the language it used.

And then there is the ecumenical politics. It is no accident that the Church of England today is often seen by critics as ineffectual, too ready to succumb to compromise, to appease those who seek social change, to reinterpret the Scriptures. A Church which seemingly does not understand theological rigour, which will bend with the wind in order to accommodate the latest social trend, where some of its bishops sometimes seem scarcely to believe in God, let alone be too doctrinaire about how one should worship Him. Well, perhaps. But that is surely a natural consequence of it having sprung from a movement which loathed and distrusted heavy-handed centralised authority; which felt that God’s word was the property of the people rather than the Church, and was thus open to a multitude of divergent interpretations.

We have been defined by what has happened, not by what should or might have happened. That strange British blend of obstinacy and a lack of deference to authority, of enormous tolerance of different points of view, of different creeds and faiths, is traceable directly to Tyndale — sitting at his desk in exile in Antwerp, about to be betrayed by agents, shortly to be strangled and then burned to death at the stake. From Antwerp, his New Testament crossed the North Sea, secreted in other less godly but more legitimate manuscripts. They arrived in England, where they were either seized and burned by the authorities or read and read again, a thousand times over.

You can erase the crosses from the walls of the House of Commons; you can melt down the coins and tear up the flags. But you cannot quite erase history or change what history has — for better or for worse — made us.

Rod Liddle’s documentary The Battle for the Bible will be shown on Channel 4 early in the new year.
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 15th December 2006, 20:08
McDink's Avatar
McDink McDink is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 334
RELIGION should have no place in any school.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 15th December 2006, 22:04
Somarlidh Somarlidh is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 39
Religion in schools

Couldn't agree more with you Mcdink.No place for the teachings of division.
__________________
Buaidh no bas
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 16th December 2006, 02:34
bell-the-cat's Avatar
bell-the-cat bell-the-cat is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 204
Quote:
Originally Posted by Somarlidh View Post
No place for the teachings of division.
Or the teachings of multiplication, addition, or subtraction.


Will someone please post something that is genuinely worth talking about in this god-forsaken forum.
__________________
Meow!
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 17th December 2006, 21:57
teashoci teashoci is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 683
as it is the 21st century, I believe teaching ooga booga (religious education) is dangerous , wrong and in no way reflects the mainly athiest/non religious affiliated general population of scotland.
religion plays no part in many scots lives, and as a result children should not be forced to listen to drivel taught by lunatics who worship the flying sky faery.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 18th December 2006, 03:01
bell-the-cat's Avatar
bell-the-cat bell-the-cat is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 204
Quote:
Originally Posted by teashoci View Post
... flying sky faery.
Now that I would worship!
__________________
Meow!
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 18th December 2006, 10:10
Gypsum_Fantastic's Avatar
Gypsum_Fantastic Gypsum_Fantastic is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 847
The Scottish census in 2001 reported that just over two-thirds (67%) of the Scottish population regarded themselves as currently having a religion. More than six out of ten people said that their religion was Christian (65%): 42% Church of Scotland, 16% Roman Catholics and 7% Other Christian.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 20:58.

All Rights Reserved © 1995 - | NewMedia Holdings, Inc. The Scotland Channel is operated under license to Paley Media, Inc. which is solely responsible for its content. All trademarks and web sites that appear throughout this site are the property of their respective owners. No part of this site shall be reproduced, copied, or otherwise distributed without the express, written consent of Paley Media, Inc. This site is not affiliated with any government entity associated with a name similar to the site domain name.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.0.0 RC4 © 2006, Crawlability, Inc.