Brainstorming verses: Think harder...!

[khaledx76]

Long time no see Gents...

Since no one has denied the wrapping of the muscles over the bone verse mentioned in Qur'an, take note of the following signs:


The Identity in the Fingerprint

While it is stated in the Qur'an that it is easy for God to bring man back to life after death, peoples' fingerprints are particularly emphasized:

"Yes, We are able to put together in perfect order the very tips of his fingers."
(The Qur'an, 75:3-4)

Everyone, including identical twins, has a unique fingerprint. In other words, people's identities are coded at their fingertips. This coding system may also be compared to the barcode system that is used today.

The emphasis on fingerprints has a very special meaning. This is because everyone's fingerprint is unique to himself. Every person who is alive or who has ever lived in this world has a set of unique fingerprints.

That is why fingerprints are accepted as a very important proof of identity, exclusive to their owner, and are used for this purpose around the world.

But what is important is that this feature of fingerprints was only discovered in the late 19th century. Before then, people regarded fingerprints as ordinary curves without any specific importance or meaning. However in the Qur'an, God points to the fingertips, which did not attract anyone's attention at that time, and calls our attention to their importance-an importance that was only finally understood in our day.



Darkness in the Seas and Internal Waves

"Or (the unbelievers' state) are like the darkness of a fathomless sea which is covered by waves above which are waves above which are clouds, layers of darkness, one upon the other. If he puts out his hand, he can scarcely see it. Those God gives no light to, they have no light."
(The Qur'an, 24:40)

The general environment in deep seas is described in the book named Oceans:

The darkness in deep seas and oceans is found around a depth of 200 meters and below. At this depth, there is almost no light. Below a depth of 1000 meters there is no light at all.(12)

Today, we know about the general structure of the sea, the characteristics of the living things in it, its salinity, as well as the amount of water it contains, its surface area and depth. Submarines and special equipment, developed with modern technology, enable scientists to obtain this information.

Human beings are not able to dive more than 40 meters down without the aid of special equipment. They cannot survive unaided in the deep, dark parts of the oceans, such as at a depth of 200 meters. For these reasons, scientists have only recently been able to discover these detailed pieces of information about seas. However, the statement of "darkness in a deep sea" was used in Sura Nur 1,400 years ago. It is certainly one of the miracles of the Qur'an that such information was given at a time where no equipment to enable man to dive into the depths of the oceans was available.


Measurements made with today's technology have revealed that between 3 and 30 percent of the sunlight is reflected at the surface of the sea. Then, almost all of the seven colours of the light spectrum are absorbed, one after another, in the first 200 meters, except for blue light (picture at left). Below a depth of 1,000 meters, there is no light at all. (above picture). This scientific fact was pointed out in the verse 40 of Sura Nur in the Qur'an 1,400 years ago.

In addition, the statement in verse 40 of Sura Nur "…like the darkness of a fathomless sea which is covered by waves above which are waves above which are clouds…" draws our attention to another miracle of the Qur'an.

The picture to the left represents internal waves at interface between two layers of water of different densities. The lower layer is denser then the upper one. This scientific fact, declared in verse 40 of Sura Nur of the Qur'an 14 centuries ago, has been discovered by today's scientists only very recently.



Scientists have recently discovered that there are internal waves, which "occur on density interfaces between layers of different densities." These internal waves cover the deep waters of seas and oceans because deep water has a higher density than the water above it. Internal waves act like surface waves. They can break, just like surface waves. Internal waves cannot be seen by the human eye, but they can be detected by studying temperature or salinity changes at a given location.(13)

The statements in the Qur'an run absolutely parallel to the above explanation. Without research, one can only see the waves on the surface of the sea. It is impossible for one to know about the internal waves beneath the sea. Yet, in Sura Nur, God draws our attention to another type of wave that occurs in the depths of the oceans. Certainly, this fact, which scientists has discovered very recently, shows once again that the Qur'an is the word of God.


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12- Elder, Danny; and John Pernetta, 1991, Oceans, London, Mitchell Beazley Publishers, p. 27
13- Gross, M. Grant; 1993, Oceanography, a View of Earth, 6. edition, Englewood Cliffs, Prentice-Hall Inc., p. 205

[Fear_nam_Beanntan]

"Yes, We are able to put together in perfect order the very tips of his fingers."
(The Qur'an, 75:3-4)

The "very tips of his fingers" could just be a figure of speech for his outermost extremities. The verse says nothing of fingerprints.

Human beings are not able to dive more than 40 meters down without the aid of special equipment. They cannot survive unaided in the deep, dark parts of the oceans, such as at a depth of 200 meters. For these reasons, scientists have only recently been able to discover these detailed pieces of information about seas. However, the statement of "darkness in a deep sea" was used in Sura Nur 1,400 years ago.

You don't have to go down to the bottom of the ocean to figure out that it's dark down there. All you have to do is go out on a boat and look down at the water. You can't see down very far. It's dark.

In addition, the statement in verse 40 of Sura Nur "…like the darkness of a fathomless sea which is covered by waves above which are waves above which are clouds…" draws our attention to another miracle of the Qur'an.

The picture to the left represents internal waves at interface between two layers of water of different densities. The lower layer is denser then the upper one. This scientific fact, declared in verse 40 of Sura Nur of the Qur'an 14 centuries ago, has been discovered by today's scientists only very recently.

You're pretending that the verse contains details which are not there. It says nothing of density layers; it simply says that there are waves on top of waves. You can see waves on top of waves on the surface of the sea.

[khaledx76]

I think you had a hastily denying post without enough consideration...

Do you want the term "Fingerprint" to appear 1400 yrs ago? Don't you think that using "fingertip" would magnificently imply the abilities of the Creator in a metaphoric manner?


Main Entry: fin·ger·print
Pronunciation: -"print
Function: noun
1 : the impression of a fingertip on any surface; also : an ink impression of the lines upon the fingertip taken for the purpose of identification

Let's see what others got to say....

[CreepingJesus]

"Yes, We are able to put together in perfect order the very tips of his fingers."

Says nothing whatsoever about fingerprints.

You can try to reword it all you like it still says what it says.

What's this supposed to prove anyway?

Somebody wrote this 1300 years ago therefore your god exists?

How do you make that connection?

Where's thye logic in that?

Away and find something that at least makes sense and stop wasting people's time!

[CreepingJesus]

Go here

http://www.infidels.org/news/atheism/logic.html

for a quick lesson in why your arguments don't work...

[khaledx76]

Originally posted by CreepingJesus

Away and find something that at least makes sense and stop wasting people's time!

So what does really make you come around, review posts, deny your analytical capabilites (which I'm sure your academic position suggests thier existence, see how can I neutrally analyze?)) when it comes to Allah's creation, and waste your own time?

You cannot see God, but the logic and clues assuring his existence are much more than the doubts: one clue would be enough (Remember that you couldn't deny the wrapping bones with muscles issue?)

Allah Says (Qur'an isn't the prophet's -peace & blessings be upon him- writing):

Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? Or did they create the heavens and the earth? Surely, they have no firm belief. Or are the treasures of your Lord with them, or have they control over them?" (The Qur’an, 52:35-37)

Originally posted by CreepingJesus
"Yes, We are able to put together in perfect order the very tips of his fingers."

Says nothing whatsoever about fingerprints.

Use some analysis: Logic suggests that "fingerprints" shouldn't be mentioned because:

1- Putting finget tips together back in perfect order involves the recreation of the fingerprints: He would recreate you down to your very details, and you'll be sweating by then...

2- they didn't need (or even knew) fingerprints then...



One more verse for your study:



The Region That Controls Our Motivation and Movements



"No indeed! If he does not stop, We will grab him by the forelock, a lying, sinful forelock."
(The Qur'an, 96:15-16)

The expression "the lying, sinful forelock" in the above verse is most interesting. Research carried out in recent years revealed that the prefrontal area, which is responsible for the management of particular functions of the brain, lies in the frontal part of the skull. Scientists only discovered the functions of this area, which the Qur'an pointed out 1,400 years ago, in the last 60 years. If we look inside the skull at the front of the head, we will find the frontal area of the cerebrum. A book entitled Essentials of Anatomy and Physiology, which includes the results of the latest research on the functions of this area, says:

The motivation and the foresight to plan and initiate movements occur in the anterior portion of the frontal lobes, the prefrontal area. This is a region of association cortex…(14)

The book also says:

In relation to its involvement in motivation, the prefrontal area is also thought to be the functional center for aggression…(15)

So, this area of the cerebrum is responsible for planning, motivation, and initiating good and sinful behaviour, and is responsible for telling lies and the truth.

It is clear that the statement "the lying, sinful forelock" corresponds completely to the above explanations. This fact, which scientists have only discovered in the last 60 years, was stated by God in the Qur'an long years ago.


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14- Seeley, Rod R.; Trent D. Stephens; and Philip Tate, 1996, Essentials of Anatomy & Physiology, 2. edition, St. Louis, Mosby-Year Book Inc., p. 211; Noback, Charles R.; N. L. Strominger; and R. J. Demarest, 1991, The Human Nervous System, Introduction and Review, 4. edition, Philadelphia, Lea & Febiger , p. 410-411

15- Seeley, Rod R.; Trent D. Stephens; and Philip Tate, 1996, Essentials of Anatomy & Physiology, 2. edition, St. Louis, Mosby-Year Book Inc., p. 211

[CreepingJesus]

You cannot see God, but the logic and clues assuring his existence are much more than the doubts: one clue would be enough (Remember that you couldn't deny the wrapping bones with muscles issue?

As I recall that thread was locked. That was the reason i didn't come back on it.

The description of embryonic bones forming first and then being surrounded by tissue is wrong. This is an observable fact.

Your tried to support your nonsensical claim by citing the work of Keith Moore

from
http://www.mukto-mona.com/Articles/h..._embyology.htm

Dr. Keith L. Moore, Ph.D., F.I.A.C. of the Department of Anatomy, University of Toronto, Canada, has become a favorite of Islamic apologists ever since he accepted an invitation to produce a special edition of his Embryology Text Book specifically for use by Muslim students in Islamic Universities.

In articles published widely across Islamic web sites, Dr. Moore goes on the record to provide a generous assessment of the Qu’ran and hadith in the light of modern knowledge about embryology. But a review of his “analysis” shows the extent to which he had to twist both the Islamic scriptures and modern science in order to get the “facts” to correlate.

Specifically, Moore’s intellectual lapses are these:

1) He liberally translates Arabic into terms that no Arabic speaker would consider justified, but that allows him to pretend the Arabic is closer to truth than it really is. For example, in spite of the fact that almost three dozen translations of “alaqah” found on line never once exclude the word “clot,” Moore writes instead that “The word "alaqah" refers to a leech or bloodsucker.”

2) He completely ignores the timing of phases dictated by the hadith, for to consider them renders even his mistranslation unintelligeble. For example, after mistranslating “alaqah” to mean “a leech or bloodsucker,” he then compares it to the human embryo at 24 days gestation. But 24 days is still firmly within the “nutfah” phase, when the embryo should actually look like a “drop of seed.” He does the same with “mudghah,” comparing it with the embryo at 28 days, still in the “nutfah” phase and only four days later than he had assigned to “alaqah.”

One might speculate on the reasons Dr. Moore might have for this travesty of embryology, but actually the answer is a simple one. He was apparently quite well paid for essentially no real additional work. The textbook he delivered to the Saudi Universities that commissioned the work is titled, "The Developing Human: Clinically Oriented Embryology with Islamic Additions." (ISBN 0-7216-6472-5).

The base textbook is work that Moore had apparently completed years before, while the “Islamic Additions” appear to be the work of an Abdul-Majeed A. Azzindani, and not Dr. Moore’s at all.

And an interesting side bar (of no real importance, but entertaining none the less) is that the Acknowledgments for the book recognize a number of “distinguished scholars” who supported the book with time or money. And number 6 on the list?

Sheik Osamah bin Ladin.