AMAZING!!: Miracles in the Qur'an

[khaledx76]

Originally posted by CreepingJesus

Aye right!

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles...le.asp?ID=5676

http://www.newsindia-times.com/2002/...women-top.html

http://www.time.com/time/asia/magazine/article/0,13673,501020527-238673,00.html

http://www.panos.org.uk/global/featu...d=1001&ID=1005

http://www.newsandletters.org/Issues...Bibi_Jun02.htm

http://www.iran-e-azad.org/stoning/women.html

http://mehr.org/stoning_list.htm

So this is ok is it?

No it's not.

It is simply plain evil.

It is men exercising power over women for their own selfish ends and justifying it with religious claptrap.

And it's OK because "only a few" countries do it?

Does anybody else find this attitude disgusting?




[Edited by CreepingJesus on 20th February 2004 at 14:18]

WOW...I just love when somebody who doesn't know basics of Islamic law goes so deep in it, takes news from here and there about Muslims who left Islamic law far behind their back, then some hasty enemies of the publishing source use those accidents for political reasons and for the sake of propaganda:

The punishments are equal for women and men in Islam:

“The woman and the man guilty of adultery or fornication,- flog each of them with a hundred stripes: Let not compassion move you in their case, in a matter prescribed by Allah, if ye believe in Allah and the Last Day: and let a party of the Believers witness their punishment.”(An-Noor:2).


However, God made it very difficult for a Zina crime to be witnessed, and it's almost impossible to prove:

Slandering Innocent Women

http://www.islamonline.net/fatwa/eng...hFatwaID=11672

If they slander that innocent girl, accusing her of zina, then they are criminals. This is a major sin and an abhorrent forbidden action, because it is a slander against her honor and a transgression of the limits set by Allah. The Qur'an says,"...and those who accuse honorable women but bring not four witnesses, scourge them with 80 stripes and never afterwards accept their testimony. They indeed are evildoers." (An-Nur: 4) In another verse Allah says, "Lo! As for those who slander virtuous, believing women who are careless, cursed are they in the world and in the hereafter. There's will be an awful doom." (An-Nur: 23)

The Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) said: “Avoid the seven sins that doom one to Hell.” They said: “O Messenger of Allah, what are they?” He said: “Associating others with Allah (shirk), witchcraft, killing a soul whom Allah has forbidden us to kill, except when it is lawful, consuming riba, consuming the orphan’s wealth, running away from the battlefield, and slandering chaste believing women who never even think of anything touching their chastity.” (Reported by al-Bukhari and Muslim)


Not even pregnancy could be taken as a sole proof for Zina:

Pregnancy: A Sole Proof for Zina?

http://www.islamonline.net/fatwa/eng...hFatwaID=79895

Those extra measures were taken to the advantage of women compared to men.



And check this out about the civilized, wild wild west, YEEEHA:

From:

http://www.aic.gov.au/publications/p.../goldsmith.pdf

SEXUAL OFFENDERS
AND PORNOGRAPHY:
A CAUSAL CONNECTION?


“…..The problem with using reported rape rates alone has created a great deal of confusion researchers. Reported rape data, for example, are often used to deny any connection between pornography and rape. However, the reported rape rate is extremely low in Sweden, not because rape is rare but because the level of conviction is so low: in 1990 only 12.3 per cent of charged rapists were convicted. Not surprisingly, Swedish women are reluctant to pursue charges in the face of such a low likelihood of gaining a conviction. The statistical yearbook of Sweden for 1992 (325) reports a 34.9 per cent increase in rape from 1986 to 1990 (during a period when the population grew by 0.4 per cent). (For further discussion of Swedish and Danish data and detailed analysis of a number of critics of thecpornography-rape nexus, see Reisman 1992)….."

Where are you from? I could find some good article about date rapes in your home town....


The western civilization is at its peak today (and I don’t think it’d go much farther). And according to your atheist tendencies, things are at their best, since this civilization is practically secular and the only areas religions are practiced are in worshipping places...

But you can still see, regardless of the progress reached, that there are high rates of rape, suicide, and other crimes in the west, which are the results of chauvinist driven psychological perversion...People who are trying to find total indulgence in their life time (though they won't) because some of them somehow don't believe in heaven anymore (though the word perfect is still programmed in their minds)....



From: http://wais.stanford.edu/Gender/gend...omen51501.html

The Status of Women


“…Hinting that Islam as such is more violent against women than Christianity as such is simply untrue. It is true that women are terribly opressed in islamic Afghanistan, but this has more to do with the Taliban power's misuse of religious dogma than with the religion itself. In Kenya, for instance, women are much freer -and suffer less violence and rape- in the islamic coast than in the Christian inland regions. And the law is theoretically the same in both regions. For one thing, Muslim women in Kenya are not forced to undergo clitoridectomy, whereas women in some animist and Christian tribes are….”

What to know more about Islam as a political system running a society from A-Z?

Read this fine article: Islam And Democracy: The Emerging Consensus

http://www.islamonline.net/english/C...rticle15.shtml

I'd just thank Allah that a superficially educated person like you fell in my hands....

Shoot whatever you want....tell me what other misconceptions do you have???!!!!!

[khaledx76]

[quote]Originally posted by CreepingJesus

Previously the big scary sky god's representatives could stifle any scientific developments that were contrary to scripture.

After the Reformation that was harder.

This enabled the west to get on with developing their economies and technology.

In the Islamic world where the rulers depended heavily on religion to keep them in power, this was not the case, and that part of a once-promising civilaisation fell into a decay.

Less time on their knees and more time looking for proper answers might have made a diference, but they fell victim to colonialism and now we have the benighted Islamic nations ruled by an elite which uses the people's gullibility and superstition to keep them at heel.

You think I'm wrong?

Look at the vast divisions between the elite and the poor in Saudi Arabia.

Look at the undermining of democracy by election-rigging mullahs in Iran this very day.

Look at Pakistan's huge nuclear weapons program in the face of grinding poverty among its poor because it's goverment wants a dick-measuring competition with the Indians.

you are talking as if you know everything...Mr. know it all...

No one is considered to be a divine representative in Islam, except in Iran, and that was highlighted about Christianity and Judaism in the holy Qur'an:

They take their priests and their anchorites to be their lords in derogation of Allah, and (they take as their Lord) Christ the son of Mary; yet they were commanded to worship but One Allah: there is no god but He. Praise and glory to Him: (Far is He) from having the partners they associate (with Him). (Al-Tawba: 31)…


We were much better when real just systems were governing the Islamic world...and it will come back by Allah's will..

P.S. change your nick to: mr. know it all!! it really fits you...

[ANDY-J2]

Originally posted by khaledx76

I'd just thank Allah that a superficially educated person like you fell in my hands....

Shoot whatever you want....tell me what other misconceptions do you have???!!!!!

Well that's interesting because I think anyone reading the debate on this thread would conclude that you collected second prize.You're the one who has resorted to petty minded insults therefore we must conclude that you're the one who ran out of coherent arguments.

[moonchaser]

Personal insults and degrading name calling have no place in a debate or discussion.

I am closing this thread. If you would all like to discuss this is more detail, please start another thread. If it degenerates into preschool name calling we will close it again.

Thank you.