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[Lianachan]

Originally Posted by ANDY-J3

I don't accept the term absorbed is valid- it suggests a wholesale adoption of Gaelic culture and lifestyle when in reality I suspect they simply found it convenient to adopt the Gaelic tongue just as they found it convenient to adopt Inglis in the later middle ages.

Indeed. I accepted the term here only as a distinction from "wiped out", which used to be commonly assumed.

[Hugh2]

Originally Posted by Croi Sasanach

If Picts were absorbed into the Gaelic speaking population, and inturn Gaels are absorbed into the English speaking population - arn't the 'English' doing to the 'Gaels' what they did onto others?

Well, perhaps the Picts were not actually "absorbed" into the original Scots population. "Assimilated" is probably a better word.
Note the definition: assimilate: to make similar: to convert into a like substance: to take fully into the mind: to modify (a speech sound), making it more like a neighbouring sound in a word or sentence.

So, if our founding Scots Gaelic language dies so does our true Scots identity.

[Lianachan]

Originally Posted by Hugh2

Well, perhaps the Picts were not actually "absorbed" into the original Scots population. "Assimilated" is probably a better word.
Note the definition: assimilate: to make similar: to convert into a like substance: to take fully into the mind: to modify (a speech sound), making it more like a neighbouring sound in a word or sentence.

Assimilated is a worse word than absorbed. Actually, it's now assumed to have been a merge.

Originally Posted by Hugh2

So, if our founding Scots Gaelic language dies so does our true Scots identity.

You are overstating that, tenuous, point.

[ANDY-J3]

Originally posted by Hugh2

Well, perhaps the Picts were not actually "absorbed" into the original Scots population. "Assimilated" is probably a better word.


The textual evidence doesn't exist to tell us exactly what occured but it has to be noted that the Pictish monarch had on several occasions ruled over the Scots of Dalriada without it diminishing their culture or sense of identity. I would think that the Picts were forced to accept the Scots King and aristocracy as their feudal superiors but other than that their life and culture would have continued pretty much unchanged and the textual evidence that does exist in the form of architecture and standing stones shows Anglo-Saxon influences were becoming increasingly common. Significantly Inglis spread quickly into the very areas that had been Pictish suggesting perhaps that Gaelic language and culture had failed to really establish itself in those areas.



So, if our founding Scots Gaelic language dies so does our true Scots identity.

That isn't remotely true. Gaelic is an important part of our cultural heritage and everything must be done to preserve it but it is only one facet of our Scottish identity and history. If it dies it would be unfortunate but given that only about 1% of Scots currently speak it I doubt if its demise would greatly affect people or their sense of Scottishness.

[Hugh2]

Originally Posted by Lianachan

Assimilated is a worse word than absorbed. Actually, it's now assumed to have been a merge.
You are overstating that, tenuous, point.

Why tenuous? Please explain? Surely, if Scots-Gaelic dies our genuine Scots Celtic identity dies with it? What about Wales? If Cumraeg dies so does the true identity of the Welsh people and, indeed, the true British language and culture dies as well?

"Merge" - well, fair enough!

[Lianachan]

Originally Posted by Hugh2

Why tenuous? Please explain? Surely, if Scots-Gaelic dies our genuine Scots Celtic identity dies with it? What about Wales? If Cumraeg dies so does the true identity of the Welsh people and, indeed, the true British language and culture dies as well?

I refer you to the answer given above by ANDY-J3.

[Hugh2]

Originally Posted by Lianachan

I refer you to the answer given above by ANDY-J3.

I, in turn, refer you back to Albanactus: "[Gaelic] was the language of the Scots. It was, after all, the "Kingdom of the Scots" ...not the "Kingdom of the English."". Also, "the correct English translation of Scotia is Gael-land, in the same way Angle-land is the correct translation of Alglia...".

Arguably, from an Anglo-Saxon, world supremacist, point of view Cumraeg is also really only "one facet" of Welsh identity and history. Quite frankly, if Cumraeg dies the true British and Welsh language and culture dies with it.

Or, are you implying that the true Welsh language is, or ought to be, the group of English dialects which are spoken in Wales given that 75% of the Welsh shamefully do not speak Cumraeg?