Clans and septs

[aluminati]

Do any scots here think that the vast majority of septs are very dubious. I mean when I hear people trying to attribute septs to clans. It seems as though every clan has about 1000 + septs.

American - "My name is hamish achmed, what clan is my sept derived from"

I mean is it me or is the whole sept thing rather bull****. I am pretty sure nearly all of them had no ties to clans or anything. Is the whole sept idea just the over imaginative writings of sir walter scott ?

what do other scots on the forum think ?

[Polwarth]

Jings, you certainly like to live dangerously....

[aluminati]

Yeah I just noticed it might start another 30 plus page thread like the last one !

[jet57]

Septs vs associations. The sept is reserved for sept houses or Captains of the Chief: i.e. Argyll, then Cawdor and Breadalbane. “Which Campbell?” someone might ask. All being originally Campbells of Lochow; the original seat. Septs usually have a patronymic name, which has created many spin-off surnames, which in turn have associated names as well, which is I suppose how we get the 1000.

Associated names come under what most refer to as a sept today: through marriage or allegiance. Most of the time people try and find where their surname originated and assign a clan name to it. As to the question: Dubious? I dunno, perhaps uninformed; commercially enhanced… (find me a tartan, sort of thing) . Scots that I know are one of two ways about it: they throw up their hands and say: “Okay fine! Let’s have a dram”.
Or, “if you’re going to be of this descent then learn it the right way”. Which gets real complicated and can be very arcane, which is probably why the other half throw up their hands.

Regards

[aluminati]

I have lived in scotland my whole life and I have never met a scot who has ever considered themselves as part of a clan. The clan system being dead means that you cannot actually in a sept or a clan.

As you may well know, tartans being designated to clans are a fallacy created by sir walter scott. Many amercians attempt to wear a "clan tartan" through dubious method of septs. its this coneection that makes me think that most of it if not all is bull****.

I would like to hear the thoughts of what other scots think though.

[Duthill]

Did you live in another Scotland ,
or is it ,
that the Scots that know you , do not discuss their ancestry with you ?

[lonestar]

i've spent the last month going back and forth between john o' groats and thurso with stops in castletown and all points in between. seems like plenty of the good folks here have a story to tell about their clans. i see they are sporting a fair amount of their colors and seem to know the history to go with them. are you saying they are clinging to some kind of cultural delusion and that their notion of clans is a farce? did i mention it's cold here?